Comments on: Putin’s Israel http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm A Machiavellian Perspective on the Middle East Conflict Thu, 02 Feb 2012 06:09:32 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Leonardo http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm/comment-page-1#comment-115794 Leonardo Tue, 06 Jul 2010 20:40:28 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm#comment-115794 I'm laughing reading most of the posts. 1. Putin, Obama and Nathaniahu are marionettes of oligarchs - Russian, American and Israeli respectively. None of them decides nothing but just vocalize decisions made by their bosses. There is a subtle difference between Putin and others - Putin is oligarch by himself (reportedly he worth ~47B USD) and a part of the Family - ruling circle of oligarchs in Russia. Most of them are Jewish or have Jewish roots including Putin. Moscow major Luzhkov during more then 20 years ruling his 12 million empire producing fifth of the Russian GDP is Jewish. It looks like all of them has some sentiment toward Israel. It is not quite clear what direction has a vector of influence Russia - Israel 2. It is right that some of new immigrants from CIS in Israel have bought false documents but I don't see FSB's operation hear but can't exclude this possibility. This is rather a result of pragmatic search of a better economic conditions. They are not a problem for Israel as they are a minority of immigration flow and try to perform more as Jews than real Jews afraiding to be disclosed. A bigger problem is non-jewish immigration allowed by law. Israeli law gives a right to enter Israel and immediately obtain Israeli citizenship for grandchildren of Jews and their spouses and children. There are about 50% non-jewish immigrants of 1.200.000 since 1987. Part of this population is not too loyal. There are even neo-nazi antisemitic groups. 3. Gaidamak will never come to Israel because of criminal charges and Leviev have left Israel for London. 4. It looks like Pollard case is very complicated but it's obvious that he succeeded to enrage the intelligence community. Four past directors of Naval Intelligence, William Studeman, Sumner Shapiro, John L. Butts, and Thomas Brooks, authored a response to the talk of clemency and what they termed "the myths that have arisen from this clever public relations campaign... aimed at transforming Pollard from greedy, arrogant betrayer of the American national trust into Pollard, committed Israeli patriot".[58] They asserted that Pollard passed information to three other countries before engaging in espionage activity on behalf of Israel, and that he had offered his services to a fourth country while he was spying for Israel.[58] They continued, “ We... feel obligated to go on record with the facts regarding Pollard in order to dispel the myths that have arisen from this clever public relations campaign... aimed at transforming Pollard from greedy, arrogant betrayer of the American national trust in to Pollard, committed Israeli patriot Pollard pleaded guilty and therefore never was publicly tried. Thus, the American people never came to know that he offered classified information to three other countries before working for the Israelis and that he offered his services to a fourth country while he was spying for Israel. They also never came to understand that he was being highly paid for his services.... Pollard and his apologists argue he turned over to the Israelis information they were being denied that was critical to their security. The fact is, however, Pollard had no way of knowing what the Israeli government was already receiving by way of official intelligence exchange agreements... Some of the data he compromised had nothing to do with Israeli security or even with the Middle East. He betrayed worldwide intelligence data, including sources and methods developed at significant cost to the U.S. taxpayer. As a result of his perfidy, some of those sources are lost forever. ...Another claim Pollard made is that the U.S. government reneged on its bargain not to seek the life sentence. What is not heard is that Pollard's part of the bargain was to cooperate fully in an assessment of the damage he had done and to refrain from talking to the press prior to the completion of his sentencing. He blatantly and contemptuously failed to live up to either part of the plea agreement... It was this coupled with the magnitude and consequences of his criminal actions that resulted in the judge imposing a life sentence... The appellate court subsequently upheld the life sentence. If, as Pollard and his supporters claim, he has "suffered enough" for his crimes, he is free to apply for parole as the American judicial system provides. In his arrogance, he has refused to do so, but insists on being granted clemency or a pardon. ” Eric Margolis alleges that Pollard's spying may have led to the capture and execution of CIA spies in the Eastern Bloc after Israel sold or bartered Pollard's information to the Soviet Union. I’m laughing reading most of the posts. 1. Putin, Obama and Nathaniahu are marionettes of oligarchs – Russian, American and Israeli respectively. None of them decides nothing but just vocalize decisions made by their bosses. There is a subtle difference between Putin and others – Putin is oligarch by himself (reportedly he worth ~47B USD) and a part of the Family – ruling circle of oligarchs in Russia. Most of them are Jewish or have Jewish roots including Putin. Moscow major Luzhkov during more then 20 years ruling his 12 million empire producing fifth of the Russian GDP is Jewish. It looks like all of them has some sentiment toward Israel. It is not quite clear what direction has a vector of influence Russia – Israel
2. It is right that some of new immigrants from CIS in Israel have bought false documents but I don’t see FSB’s operation hear but can’t exclude this possibility. This is rather a result of pragmatic search of a better economic conditions. They are not a problem for Israel as they are a minority of immigration flow and try to perform more as Jews than real Jews afraiding to be disclosed.
A bigger problem is non-jewish immigration allowed by law. Israeli law gives a right to enter Israel and immediately obtain Israeli citizenship for grandchildren of Jews and their spouses and children. There are about 50% non-jewish immigrants of 1.200.000 since 1987. Part of this population is not too loyal. There are even neo-nazi antisemitic groups.
3. Gaidamak will never come to Israel because of criminal charges and Leviev have left Israel for London.
4. It looks like Pollard case is very complicated but it’s obvious that he succeeded to enrage the intelligence community.
Four past directors of Naval Intelligence, William Studeman, Sumner Shapiro, John L. Butts, and Thomas Brooks, authored a response to the talk of clemency and what they termed “the myths that have arisen from this clever public relations campaign… aimed at transforming Pollard from greedy, arrogant betrayer of the American national trust into Pollard, committed Israeli patriot”.[58] They asserted that Pollard passed information to three other countries before engaging in espionage activity on behalf of Israel, and that he had offered his services to a fourth country while he was spying for Israel.[58] They continued,
“ We… feel obligated to go on record with the facts regarding Pollard in order to dispel the myths that have arisen from this clever public relations campaign… aimed at transforming Pollard from greedy, arrogant betrayer of the American national trust in to Pollard, committed Israeli patriot
Pollard pleaded guilty and therefore never was publicly tried. Thus, the American people never came to know that he offered classified information to three other countries before working for the Israelis and that he offered his services to a fourth country while he was spying for Israel. They also never came to understand that he was being highly paid for his services….
Pollard and his apologists argue he turned over to the Israelis information they were being denied that was critical to their security. The fact is, however, Pollard had no way of knowing what the Israeli government was already receiving by way of official intelligence exchange agreements… Some of the data he compromised had nothing to do with Israeli security or even with the Middle East. He betrayed worldwide intelligence data, including sources and methods developed at significant cost to the U.S. taxpayer. As a result of his perfidy, some of those sources are lost forever.
…Another claim Pollard made is that the U.S. government reneged on its bargain not to seek the life sentence. What is not heard is that Pollard’s part of the bargain was to cooperate fully in an assessment of the damage he had done and to refrain from talking to the press prior to the completion of his sentencing. He blatantly and contemptuously failed to live up to either part of the plea agreement… It was this coupled with the magnitude and consequences of his criminal actions that resulted in the judge imposing a life sentence… The appellate court subsequently upheld the life sentence.
If, as Pollard and his supporters claim, he has “suffered enough” for his crimes, he is free to apply for parole as the American judicial system provides. In his arrogance, he has refused to do so, but insists on being granted clemency or a pardon.
”
Eric Margolis alleges that Pollard’s spying may have led to the capture and execution of CIA spies in the Eastern Bloc after Israel sold or bartered Pollard’s information to the Soviet Union.

]]> By: JRP http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm/comment-page-1#comment-113970 JRP Sun, 13 Dec 2009 21:55:37 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm#comment-113970 The true test for President Obama is what he will do if Israel strikes Iran; and it should! The President has no track record, no one knows anything about him (no record in Congress and suspicious allies in the past). The debt issue here and those who finance the debt in the USA will call the shots from now on, i.e. China, Saudi Arabia, Japan and Britain. Israel should get very used to not having the USA as an ally. Perhaps next year we will need to withdraw our troops from Afghanistan and Iraq just to keep the peace on our city streets! Long live Israel! The true test for President Obama is what he will do if Israel strikes Iran; and it should! The President has no track record, no one knows anything about him (no record in Congress and suspicious allies in the past).
The debt issue here and those who finance the debt in the USA will call the shots from now on, i.e. China, Saudi Arabia, Japan and Britain. Israel should get very used to not having the USA as an ally. Perhaps next year we will need to withdraw our troops from Afghanistan and Iraq just to keep the peace on our city streets! Long live Israel!

]]> By: Ace http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm/comment-page-1#comment-82824 Ace Wed, 27 Feb 2008 17:18:55 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm#comment-82824 Im one of those Jewish people who lives in America now, but I immigrated from Russia. I fully support Israel in anything it does and I think that Israel should have USA as an ally. Russia can not be trusted at all. The issue here is elections. If Democrats get their way there will be no moral or financial support for Israel from USA. If Barak Obama wins the elections, there will be a lot of negative changes in Israel American relationship. He is a muslim after all. I agree with moderator about Russian jews not adapting to Israeli traditions in the country that gave them home. I appologize for that. We have the same situation here in NY, Brighton Beach to be precise. I do my part to support Israel I always will. Im one of those Jewish people who lives in America now, but I immigrated from Russia. I fully support Israel in anything it does and I think that Israel should have USA as an ally. Russia can not be trusted at all. The issue here is elections. If Democrats get their way there will be no moral or financial support for Israel from USA. If Barak Obama wins the elections, there will be a lot of negative changes in Israel American relationship. He is a muslim after all. I agree with moderator about Russian jews not adapting to Israeli traditions in the country that gave them home. I appologize for that. We have the same situation here in NY, Brighton Beach to be precise. I do my part to support Israel I always will.

]]> By: mike http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm/comment-page-1#comment-51958 mike Sun, 19 Aug 2007 03:27:21 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm#comment-51958 I like this blog! I like this blog!

]]> By: Chananiel Wizman http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm/comment-page-1#comment-28057 Chananiel Wizman Mon, 21 May 2007 13:58:13 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm#comment-28057 If we have to play sides between the Russians and the Americans then by god that is what we must do. America doesn not seem like much of an ally any more and Russia is dying to park its submarines in Haifa. Why treat Pollard like shit and why make Israel cow tow to terrorists and why give those terrorists American Armaments and Training so they could shoot Jewish civilians? These are allies? America is changing its face slowly bit by bit. If we have to play sides between the Russians and the Americans then by god that is what we must do. America doesn not seem like much of an ally any more and Russia is dying to park its submarines in Haifa. Why treat Pollard like shit and why make Israel cow tow to terrorists and why give those terrorists American Armaments and Training so they could shoot Jewish civilians? These are allies? America is changing its face slowly bit by bit.

]]> By: Danny the Admin http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm/comment-page-1#comment-19570 Danny the Admin Wed, 18 Apr 2007 13:28:36 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm#comment-19570 Frankly, I'm not thoroughly familiar with details of Pollard's case. My impression was that he passed some other data besides satellite intel. Anyway, America has a right to convict spies, but Israel can similarly capture US spies and exchange them for Pollard. That's a standard practice. Obadiah, too, wrote that US aid to Israel is bribe. I agree with you about Levaev. And the guy is soooo hypocritical. He used his influence in Chabad and with the chief rabbi to make his shopping malls working on Sabbath. Frankly, I’m not thoroughly familiar with details of Pollard’s case. My impression was that he passed some other data besides satellite intel. Anyway, America has a right to convict spies, but Israel can similarly capture US spies and exchange them for Pollard. That’s a standard practice.

Obadiah, too, wrote that US aid to Israel is bribe.
I agree with you about Levaev. And the guy is soooo hypocritical. He used his influence in Chabad and with the chief rabbi to make his shopping malls working on Sabbath.

]]> By: Ben Ness http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm/comment-page-1#comment-19550 Ben Ness Wed, 18 Apr 2007 07:47:22 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm#comment-19550 Pollard passed proof the USA broke their word they'd give Israel full relevant satellite intel which was one of the conditions for Israeli withdrawal from Lebanon and letting Arafat go free, and they (the USA) didn't. That's what he passed to Israel; all the talk of agents is BS. Two real Russian's spies in highest eschelons of CIA and FBI where later caught, I forgot their names - one the head of CIA Russian counter-intelligence (there's not much higher to go than that), the other on FBI counter-spy unit. They were the ones who passed to the Russians the American agents' names, who indeed were executed en mass by the Soviets (up to about 20 high-valued assets where killed). Pollard's case was cooked up, just as today's case agains the two AIPAC guys is cooked up, by same Saudi controlled arm in US intelligence "establishment" probably, in their obvious anti-Israel agenda, nothing to do with real counter-spy fight. As for American yearly pay-offs to Israel (about $3bn) and Egypt (about $2bn annually) it is what it is - a pay-off. For Israel, for giving up the Sinai and suffering the 80-s hyperinflation as a consequence; for Egypt - for having to bare the burden of pretense of a peace with this Devil incarnate, the Jewish State. It is very simple - the US wanted to snatch Egypt from Russia's sphere of influence, and what they paid up to now for that is apparently an acceptable price for them. Don't forget the price of a massive psy-op of the last 30 years of pushing a "piece-by-piece process" scam onto the stupid Israelis who are getting stupider and stupider with each passing year - it gets a lot of oil-dollars to dumb down the whole nation (you need to buy a lot of its politicians, journalists etc. - it all costs money). As for the Russian influence - Levayev is more dangerous because he's more subtle in his pushing the Putin's view into the Israeli's noosphere. And all Israel needs to do to be safe from Islamic agression (as Obadia has shown us) is to declare unequivocally that on any and all agression perpetrated against her by WHOEVER they will respond by bombing (with nukes) the MECCA first, and MEDINA second. Just a friendly worning. Then the Arabs would really work for the security of Israel, out of fear for what they really value. Pollard passed proof the USA broke their word they’d give Israel full relevant satellite intel which was one of the conditions for Israeli withdrawal from Lebanon and letting Arafat go free, and they (the USA) didn’t. That’s what he passed to Israel; all the talk of agents is BS. Two real Russian’s spies in highest eschelons of CIA and FBI where later caught, I forgot their names – one the head of CIA Russian counter-intelligence (there’s not much higher to go than that), the other on FBI counter-spy unit. They were the ones who passed to the Russians the American agents’ names, who indeed were executed en mass by the Soviets (up to about 20 high-valued assets where killed). Pollard’s case was cooked up, just as today’s case agains the two AIPAC guys is cooked up, by same Saudi controlled arm in US intelligence “establishment” probably, in their obvious anti-Israel agenda, nothing to do with real counter-spy fight.

As for American yearly pay-offs to Israel (about $3bn) and Egypt (about $2bn annually) it is what it is – a pay-off. For Israel, for giving up the Sinai and suffering the 80-s hyperinflation as a consequence; for Egypt – for having to bare the burden of pretense of a peace with this Devil incarnate, the Jewish State. It is very simple – the US wanted to snatch Egypt from Russia’s sphere of influence, and what they paid up to now for that is apparently an acceptable price for them. Don’t forget the price of a massive psy-op of the last 30 years of pushing a “piece-by-piece process” scam onto the stupid Israelis who are getting stupider and stupider with each passing year – it gets a lot of oil-dollars to dumb down the whole nation (you need to buy a lot of its politicians, journalists etc. – it all costs money).

As for the Russian influence – Levayev is more dangerous because he’s more subtle in his pushing the Putin’s view into the Israeli’s noosphere.

And all Israel needs to do to be safe from Islamic agression (as Obadia has shown us) is to declare unequivocally that on any and all agression perpetrated against her by WHOEVER they will respond by bombing (with nukes) the MECCA first, and MEDINA second. Just a friendly worning. Then the Arabs would really work for the security of Israel, out of fear for what they really value.

]]> By: LeBron http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm/comment-page-1#comment-19043 LeBron Fri, 13 Apr 2007 21:00:22 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm#comment-19043 i think the outcry is quite understandable. the thing is, we don't know all the details of his case, but i have a suspicion that his actions led to demise of american agents somewhere... The whole issue is strange: american jews spying in Israel, israeli jews (or american ones) spying in US... I guss, Putin is quietly (and not so quietly) doing what's in his best interests, flooding Israel with Russians. Maybe i'm being paranoid )) i think the outcry is quite understandable. the thing is, we don’t know all the details of his case, but i have a suspicion that his actions led to demise of american agents somewhere… The whole issue is strange: american jews spying in Israel, israeli jews (or american ones) spying in US… I guss, Putin is quietly (and not so quietly) doing what’s in his best interests, flooding Israel with Russians. Maybe i’m being paranoid ))

]]> By: Danny the Admin http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm/comment-page-1#comment-18399 Danny the Admin Sun, 08 Apr 2007 21:28:51 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm#comment-18399 LeBron, I agree that the Jewish outcry to release Pollard is silly. He is a spy and have to be treated as such. I guess there are enough American spies in Israel to arrest and exchange, but other than that, Jews have no right to demand pardon for Pollard. LeBron, I agree that the Jewish outcry to release Pollard is silly. He is a spy and have to be treated as such. I guess there are enough American spies in Israel to arrest and exchange, but other than that, Jews have no right to demand pardon for Pollard.

]]> By: chaim http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm/comment-page-1#comment-18160 chaim Fri, 06 Apr 2007 17:40:09 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/putins-israel.htm#comment-18160 well LeBron, I think that is this blog point. To get as much as possible people know what Israel should do for her real independence. As, for instance, tell usa thanks, NO. well LeBron, I think that is this blog point. To get as much as possible people know what Israel should do for her real independence. As, for instance, tell usa thanks, NO.

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