Comments on: Justice cannot afford niceties http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm A Machiavellian Perspective on the Middle East Conflict Thu, 02 Feb 2012 06:09:32 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Alex http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm/comment-page-1#comment-116965 Alex Thu, 04 Aug 2011 00:09:58 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm#comment-116965 Chaim, religion is not your field. Seriosuly. <blockquote>Danny, just have to look about “raping” in all the semitic nations laws.</blockquote> Weird, I don't remember Halacha being decided by other nations' statutes. <blockquote>The text you read maybe not translated right.</blockquote> He reads from the <strong>Hebrew</strong>. It's only you who reads from translations. <blockquote>The marriage is allways a issue of father authorization.In Some cases just the father maybe dead or absent,thus the differences. If the text MARKS the specific case it’s because of some reason. And Laban laying with his daughter is a example of what you have not to do…</blockquote> Chaim, seriosuly, you're speaking nonesense. Laban lied with his dauther? Which Bible do you read? <blockquote>The shekel is a wheight measure. That does not mean it’s the same shekel or the temple. </blockquote> It's your sheer imagination. <blockquote>Anyway, in the Moshe’s law, the temple is not mentioned, just the tabernacle.</blockquote> You really do not have any idea, right? Exodus 25:8 commands us to build a Temple: "and they (Israel) shall build for Me a Temple (Mikdash), so that I will dwell among them." You have many mentions of the Temple. Including Leviticus 16:33: "And he shall make an atonement for the holy sanctuary (Mikdash HaKodesh), <strong>and</strong> he shall make an atonement for the tabernacle (Ohel Mo'ed) of the congregation, and for the altar, and he shall make an atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation." - <strong>clearly it seperates the Mikdash and the Ohel.</strong> See more examples in Lev. 21:12, Num. 19:20, and many other passages. You are ignorant of Judaism, even the Karaites would not accept you. And you have the hypocricy to say that you don't need a Rabbi! Chaim, religion is not your field. Seriosuly.

Danny, just have to look about “raping” in all the semitic nations laws.

Weird, I don’t remember Halacha being decided by other nations’ statutes.

The text you read maybe not translated right.

He reads from the Hebrew. It’s only you who reads from translations.

The marriage is allways a issue of father authorization.In Some cases just the father maybe dead or absent,thus the differences. If the text MARKS the specific case it’s because of some reason. And Laban laying with his daughter is a example of what you have not to do…

Chaim, seriosuly, you’re speaking nonesense. Laban lied with his dauther? Which Bible do you read?

The shekel is a wheight measure. That does not mean it’s the same shekel or the temple.

It’s your sheer imagination.

Anyway, in the Moshe’s law, the temple is not mentioned, just the tabernacle.

You really do not have any idea, right?

Exodus 25:8 commands us to build a Temple: “and they (Israel) shall build for Me a Temple (Mikdash), so that I will dwell among them.” You have many mentions of the Temple.

Including Leviticus 16:33: “And he shall make an atonement for the holy sanctuary (Mikdash HaKodesh), and he shall make an atonement for the tabernacle (Ohel Mo’ed) of the congregation, and for the altar, and he shall make an atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” – clearly it seperates the Mikdash and the Ohel.

See more examples in Lev. 21:12, Num. 19:20, and many other passages. You are ignorant of Judaism, even the Karaites would not accept you. And you have the hypocricy to say that you don’t need a Rabbi!

]]> By: chaim http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm/comment-page-1#comment-76932 chaim Tue, 15 Jan 2008 10:19:24 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm#comment-76932 Danny, just have to look about "raping" in all the semitic nations laws. The text you read maybe not translated right. The marriage is allways a issue of father authorization.In Some cases just the father maybe dead or absent,thus the differences. If the text MARKS the specific case it's because of some reason. And Laban laying with his daughter is a example of what you have not to do... The shekel is a wheight measure. That does not mean it's the same shekel or the temple. Anyway, in the Moshe's law, the temple is not mentioned, just the tabernacle. Danny, just have to look about “raping” in all the semitic nations laws.
The text you read maybe not translated right. The marriage is allways a issue of father authorization.In Some cases just the father maybe dead or absent,thus the differences. If the text MARKS the specific case it’s because of some reason. And Laban laying with his daughter is a example of what you have not to do…
The shekel is a wheight measure. That does not mean it’s the same shekel or the temple. Anyway, in the Moshe’s law, the temple is not mentioned, just the tabernacle.

]]> By: Danny the Admin http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm/comment-page-1#comment-76854 Danny the Admin Tue, 15 Jan 2008 01:07:42 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm#comment-76854 To Chaim: Please clarify for me, how do we know that rape in the field was not expiated by forced marriage? The text seems clear: rapist may be executed wherever the crime took place. I don;t think the marriage was only a matter of her father's agreement. Even Lavan asked his daughter. The Torah speaks of Moshe's shekel, the same shekel used to pay the Temple dues according to the Torah. To Chaim: Please clarify for me, how do we know that rape in the field was not expiated by forced marriage? The text seems clear: rapist may be executed wherever the crime took place.
I don;t think the marriage was only a matter of her father’s agreement. Even Lavan asked his daughter.
The Torah speaks of Moshe’s shekel, the same shekel used to pay the Temple dues according to the Torah.

]]> By: Ray Bright http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm/comment-page-1#comment-76848 Ray Bright Mon, 14 Jan 2008 23:17:47 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm#comment-76848 This is a reply to Alexander Maistrovoy's "Give chance to peace! …Without Israel" =============== I agree with Alexander Maistrovoy on his main point that Arab identity is deeply intertwined with Islam. It is almost inseparable. I agree that so far practically all Arab peace initiatives were just a strategy towards their final goal of destruction of Israel. Unfortunately I believe that Maistrovoy is DEEPLY mistaken when he quotes from Eder: "Islam teaching is distorted be fanatics" and "Muslim clergy conceal truth about Muslim prophecies regarding Jews" It would take a lot of Talmudic twisting to make Islamic teaching accept Israel. Koran and ahadith both are anti-Semitic. They glorify Muhammad's extermination of the Jewish tribes in Medina, and proclaim that Jews are grandsons of pigs and apes. Plain and simple reading of Koran and Hadith makes a much stronger case for extermination of Jews than for acceptance of a Jews state. No moderate can win a honest debate with Islamists, Ayatollah Khomeini and the Wahabis are correct in their interpretation of Islam. The path to making Islam "moderate" is a path towards defeat. It is just as doomed as trying to make Nazism moderate. Read Mein Kampf, and you will know that according to Nazis "Jews are unproductive,parasites who destroy any culture in which they live. The only way to change Islam, is to utterly defeat it, utterly discredit it. We need to openly criticize Islam. Expose it's incompatibility modernity, it's utter idiocy and inhumanity. The West must never compromise by affording Muslims special consideration. Islam must be utterly discredited. The Danish caricatures were a good beginning. The caricatures of Muhammad having sex with his 9 years old bride should be imprinted in everybody's mind. Let the Muslims rage, let them complain, let them hear that in the West we have the freedom to criticize every religion including Islam. If they don't like it, let them go back to their Muslim countries. If they riot, or fight then defeat them militarily: It was Muhammad's military success that convinced Arabs of the "truth" of Islam. Likewise, the ultimate military defeat will convince them of it's falseness. This is a reply to Alexander Maistrovoy’s “Give chance to peace! …Without Israel”
===============
I agree with Alexander Maistrovoy on his main point that Arab identity is deeply intertwined with Islam. It is almost inseparable. I agree that so far practically all Arab peace initiatives were just a strategy towards their final goal of destruction of Israel.

Unfortunately I believe that Maistrovoy is DEEPLY mistaken when he quotes from Eder:

“Islam teaching is distorted be fanatics” and “Muslim clergy conceal truth about Muslim prophecies regarding Jews”

It would take a lot of Talmudic twisting to make Islamic teaching accept Israel. Koran and ahadith both are anti-Semitic. They glorify Muhammad’s extermination of the Jewish tribes in Medina, and proclaim that Jews are grandsons of pigs and apes.
Plain and simple reading of Koran and Hadith makes a much stronger case for extermination of Jews than for acceptance of a Jews state. No moderate can win a honest debate with Islamists, Ayatollah Khomeini and the Wahabis are correct in their interpretation of Islam. The path to making Islam “moderate” is a path towards defeat. It is just as doomed as trying to make Nazism moderate. Read Mein Kampf, and you will know that according to Nazis “Jews are unproductive,parasites who destroy any culture in which they live.
The only way to change Islam, is to utterly defeat it, utterly discredit it.
We need to openly criticize Islam. Expose it’s incompatibility modernity, it’s utter idiocy and inhumanity. The West must never compromise by affording Muslims special consideration. Islam must be utterly discredited. The Danish caricatures were a good beginning. The caricatures of Muhammad having sex with his 9 years old bride should be imprinted in everybody’s mind. Let the Muslims rage, let them complain, let them hear that in the West we have the freedom to criticize every religion including Islam. If they don’t like it, let them go back to their Muslim countries.
If they riot, or fight then defeat them militarily: It was Muhammad’s military success that convinced Arabs of the “truth” of Islam. Likewise, the ultimate military defeat will convince them of it’s falseness.

]]> By: Kashmiri Nomad http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm/comment-page-1#comment-76747 Kashmiri Nomad Sun, 13 Jan 2008 21:06:42 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm#comment-76747 <a href="http://kashmiri-nomad.blogspot.com/2008/01/islam-and-west-accelerated-links-for-13.html" rel="nofollow">Samson Blinded on the soundness of making a rapist marry his victim.</a> Samson Blinded on the soundness of making a rapist marry his victim.

]]> By: chaim http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm/comment-page-1#comment-76690 chaim Sun, 13 Jan 2008 09:58:22 +0000 http://samsonblinded.org/blog/justice-cannot-afford-niceties.htm#comment-76690 Some points: First, we should specify the "rape" figure of the law. To rape a single woman, alone in the fields, was never a issue of marrying her. This kind of rape, as we know it, was always a capital ofense, as for the Hebrews as for the peoples surrounding them. So what is the real meaning of "rape" here? Marriage was a base issue for Hebrews. As a patriarcal society, the marriage was made by buying the right to the bride's father. Rape in this case is the figure of forcing a women to have sexual intercourse without previous father agreement. This is, as Ovadiah says here, in deed a steal. If the women treated to cheat their parents saying she was raped, the parents ask why she did not cried? If the man tried to have sex with the girl without buying her, that was a staling, and the law specify prices to pay for stealing. Another point, please do not missunderstand the Silver shekel of the Moshe law with the half silver shekel of the second temple's time. Moshe siver shekel was a silver measure, without form, and the second temple half shekel was a greek coin... Some points:
First, we should specify the “rape” figure of the law.
To rape a single woman, alone in the fields, was never a issue of marrying her. This kind of rape, as we know it, was always a capital ofense, as for the Hebrews as for the peoples surrounding them.
So what is the real meaning of “rape” here?
Marriage was a base issue for Hebrews. As a patriarcal society, the marriage was made by buying the right to the bride’s father.
Rape in this case is the figure of forcing a women to have sexual intercourse without previous father agreement. This is, as Ovadiah says here, in deed a steal.
If the women treated to cheat their parents saying she was raped, the parents ask why she did not cried?
If the man tried to have sex with the girl without buying her, that was a staling, and the law specify prices to pay for stealing.
Another point, please do not missunderstand the
Silver shekel of the Moshe law with the half silver shekel of the second temple’s time.
Moshe siver shekel was a silver measure, without form, and the second temple half shekel was a greek coin…

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